By Lehlohonolo Lehana.
Advocate Dali Mpofu SC began his cross-examination by telling Public Protector investigator Sphelo Samuel that he will argue that he has “no personal knowledge” of the evidence Samuel gave.
The information was mostly in relation to Mkhwebane’s invalidated Estina Dairy Farm scam investigation. Samuel says he agrees in part.
On Wednesday, Samuel testified that, in mid-March 2017, Mkhwebane visited the Free State. Former premier Ace Magashule wanted to speak to her before she visited the legislature. At the time, the investigation into the Vrede dairy farm was ongoing.
Mkhwebane told Samuel she didn’t take instructions from Magashule, didn’t know him and would not meet with him.
A few minutes later, during the meeting, she received a call. On her return, she said she had changed her mind, and she would meet the premier, Samuel testified.
They met for 15 to 20 minutes behind closed doors. Samuel did not know what was said.
In his affidavit, Samuel said it would have been “unusual” if minutes weren’t taken to record the meeting, if Vrede was discussed.
On Thursday morning, Mpofu put it to Samuel that one of the “narratives” he wanted the Section 194 Committee to believe was that Magashule wanted to meet with Mkhwebane, but she did not want to do so. But after she received a phone call, she changed her mind. Samuel agreed.
Samuel confirmed that he believed the phone call Mkhwebane received was what led to her changing her mind.
Mpofu then spent some time dissecting the phone call.
He asserted that this was “pure speculation”. Samuel agreed, saying it was based on Mkhwebane’s behaviour.
Mpofu said if it was someone else calling her about another matter and she changed her mind after giving it some thought, Samuel’s whole “spy novel” – as he consistently called Samuel’s testimony – would fall apart.
Samuel agreed, but added that his version should have been investigated.
Mpofu said Mkhwebane did not deny having received a call during her meeting with Samuel, nor did she deny changing her mind about meeting Magashule. However, she would testify that, if she received a call, it “had nothing to do” with her subsequent decision to meet Magashule.
Mpofu also raised a matter that wasn’t heard in Samuel’s testimony the previous day – Vrede-implicated former Free State MEC Mosebenzi Zwane attending Mkhwebane’s 50th birthday party in February 2020.
Samuel raised it in an affidavit he sent to then National Assembly Speaker Thandi Modise in the same month, asking for an investigation into Mkhwebane.
At the time of the birthday party, Mkhwebane was reinvestigating Vrede.
Mpofu asked Samuel whether Mkhwebane should be removed because Zwane attended her party.
Samuel said that was for the committee to decide, but that a person should not socialise with someone they were investigating.
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Video Courtesy of Parliament.